[OMT] BVB Wembley H [CL] Wed 13 Sept 2017 19:45

Discussion in 'Match Day Chat' started by hrytn, Sep 10, 2017.

  1. hrytn Well-Known Member

    hrytn
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    First match of the CL group stages at Wembley Home against Borussia Dortmund.

    Very important opener. Make no mistake, this is the most important tie in our group. We must win if we want to be in the CL the other side of Christmas.

    Dele starts his 1st European ban out of 3 matches.

    Dortmund have some serious injury problems at the moment. They will be without Reus and Schmelzer for sure. Bartra also looks unlikely to make it after going off yesterday with a groin issue and it's probably too soon for Schurlle.
  2. Why Do We Bother? Well-Known Member

    Why Do We Bother?
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    ...........................Lloris...........................
    Trippier.........Toby.......Vert..........Davies

    ......................Dier....Dembele................

    .................Son..Eriksen..Sissoko..........

    ............................Kane.........................
  3. Del Boy N17 Active Member

    Del Boy N17
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    --------------------------Lloris------------------------------
    ---------Toby-------Sanchez--------Vertonghen------
    ----Aurier--------Dier------Dembele-----Davies-----
    -----------------Eriksen-------Son------------------------
    ---------------------------Kane-----------------------------

    No Alli isn't great which only really leaves Son as an attacking replacement, would like to see Aurier make his debut, his pace at Wembley will be a huge bonus, nothing else needs changing really, my bench would be:

    Vorm
    Trippier
    KWP
    Sissoko
    Winks
    Llorente

    I'd love to say we'll win but even with injuries Dortmund are a good side, I'm going for a 1-1 draw, hope I'm wrong & we beat them installing belief for Swansea on Saturday
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  4. BrakeYawSelf Well-Known Member

    BrakeYawSelf
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    Stinks not having Dele available but then maybe the suspension will force him to mature a little. He could still be one of the best players in the world. Needs to learn a little patience and still needs more experience.

    I never want to see Sissoko starting at AM. Even if he ends up making forward runs that's fine. But he really needs to play as CM, as a rotation player with Dembele. Never the less, he would still need one of the AM to take on some of his CM responsibilities during the game. This would most likely be Eriksen. But I don't think we should start Sissoko in such an important game against such an talented team. For now, he is better suited against PL teams outside of the top 5 and probably Cup games. If he continues to play well at CM, as Dembele's back up, then I would give him a chance in the CL.

    Here's how I would line up on Wednesday,

    ---------------Lloris------------------------
    ---Sanchez--Toby----Verts-----
    ---------------Dier-----------------
    Aurier------Dembele-------Davies
    -------Eriksen---------Son---------
    ---------------Kane------------------

    I think that might be our best current team when Dele can't play. Also, if Wanyama will return by Wednesday I might still play Dier and let Wanyama rest up for the next PL game. Not a game to mess around in. We pretty much need our best starting 11 out there. We play Swansea in the next game, so it could be a good game to rest a few players, allowing us to go all out for this game. Maybe Winks and Wanyama could be the DM/CM pairing against Swans. Sissoko played well against Everton, but we will need him as a Sub in this game, not having Dele available and if Dembele needs to be subbed for latter in the game.

    Really loving our back 3 of Sanchez, Toby and Jan though. Freeing up Dier to really focus on DM. I think he will eventually be our best DM and surpass Wanyama.

    And looking at our current available players, we probably really do need another strong AM option. Again, this isn't Sissoko. Not really. Not sure if Winks can play AM, he might be a bit slow for the role. I think we will need someone like GKN, Edwards or another youngster to step up in the mean time. All though I think Shashoua, Roles and Tracy are a bit further away than Edwards and definitely than GKN. At least until Lamela is healthy enough to play or we do end up bringing someone like Barkley in January. Hopefully either GKN or Edwards will be ready to step up in Cup games, because our other AMs will need the rest for PL/CL games.. I assume Cup games are the only games Edwards should really be tested in at this point. I am a little more hopeful that GKN could handle at least some PL games against weaker competition.
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2017
  5. Dan Northern Spurs New Member

    Dan Northern Spurs
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    you put janssen in your 2nd choice. hes gone mate
  6. EliteKiller Well-Known Member

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    We will I'm sure play a back three in front of Hugo ......

    ------------------------ Lloris ------------------------

    ----- Sanchez ------Toby ---------Verts ---------

    The midfield will be a Diamond with two WB's supporting

    -------------------------- Dier ------------------------

    Trippier ---- Dembele ---- Sissoko ---- Davies

    ------------------------ Eriksen ----------------------

    Just one up front (but he's quite good)

    -------------------------- Kane ------------------------

    That's a fairly defensive line up as both Dembele and Sissoko are predominantly CM's not AM's .... we would have great bench options ... with Wanyama (DM) or Son (AM) should we wish to switch the Diamond to a more defence or attack set-up .....

    Need a win ..... COYS
  7. TheSpurEST Well-Known Member

    TheSpurEST
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    Agreed with this lineup.

    I am not arguing that Sissoko had decent game in CM against Everton, but I mean... would anyone argue that Son is better at AM than Sissoko is in CM? Or that Dier is better at DM then Sissoko is at CM? I certainly do not and hence believe we should play Dier and Son. Rested Dembele is no-brainer and so is ever-influential Eriksen.

    Also thinking that Aurier (given that Poch believes he has been able to get up to speed with us) could get his debut in this game and everything else would be unchanged. It seems quite reasonable - we would have 3 fresh faces from weekend in Son, Aurier and Dembele.

    COYS! Would really like a win from here.
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  8. bfwolf Well-Known Member

    bfwolf
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    Seems the obvious lineup.

    Don't hope for a draw though. Anything but a win and we are in a very difficult spot for advancement.
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  9. jrg83 Well-Known Member

    jrg83
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    This is the big one for our chances of getting out of this group, must win IMO.
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  10. Boone Well-Known Member

    Boone
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    A big win on Wednesday would do so much for us in so many ways. It would put us in a prime position to advance from our group and really get our season going. All the while it would end talk of this stupid Wembley curse.
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  11. Shacklebolt 'Ello

    Shacklebolt
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    I'm fairly optmistic but at the same time we should accept that these CL nights always are tough matches. I feel that our biggest advantage this year is that our manager, the players and everyone involved with the club have experience from last season. We just looked mentally unprepared last season in the CL.
  12. TheSpurEST Well-Known Member

    TheSpurEST
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    Yea, and I kinda hate that it happened this way :( .

    Would have preferred to first visit Dortmund at their ground. I mean - from there everything is a bonus really, isn't it? But now we have somewhat of an additional pressure when we play our main competitor in terms of advancing (with Real clear fav and APOEL clear outsider)... but it is what it is and I hope our guys are hungry for win! COYS!
  13. Yorkshire Yid Well-Known Member

    Yorkshire Yid
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    We need to win this to have a real chance of qualifying really. Maximum i can see us getting of Real is one point and we should be looking at getting 6 of APOEL, so 10 points should be enough for us.
  14. bfwolf Well-Known Member

    bfwolf
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    It's better this way. If we lose tomorrow, we should put less focus on the remaining CL games in terms of player selection and focus on the PL. If we win we know to go balls to the wall with our best lineup in future games.
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  15. The Slikmeister Active Member

    The Slikmeister
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    Even though this is our 1st CL game of this season its a game I feel we have to win if we are to stand any chance of making it through to the KO phase.
    No Dele makes it that bit harder but I think we have it in us to get the result we need.
    On paper the starting 11 seems to pick itself...........
    .......................................................Lloris

    .................Toby............................Sanchez...........................Jan

    Tripps..........................Dier...............................Moose......................Davies

    ...............Eriksen.............................Kane..............................Son

    But, & it is a but. We could see Sissoko in for the Moose because there seems to be a ? with his fitness.
    Also, I know he hasn't been with us 5 mins & I'm not sure if his broken arm has heeled but If he's available there is a case for Llorente to start at CF with Harry taking Dele's role as the 2nd striker.
    We all know that Kane is more than capable of doing it, he has all the tools, but will Poch risk it in such an important game???
    I've a sneaky feeling he might so I'm sticking my neck out & predicting this 11 to start.........
    ..........................................................Lloris

    ..................Toby..............................Sanchez.............................Jan

    Tripps............................Dier................................Sissoko.....................Davies

    .................Eriksen............................Llorente.............................Kane

    Its all swings and roundabouts though & we shall see.
    COYS!!!
  16. smallsnc Well-Known Member

    smallsnc
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    I think 10 will be enough if it includes a draw and win against Dortmund. Otherwise, Dortmund will be looking for basically the same scenario we are and it could come down to goal differential.
  17. NYYiddo1019 Well-Known Member

    NYYiddo1019
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    Need a win here. Without Dele it's going to be tough, but that should not be the excuse. Play Sanchez in a back three, Aurier at RB, and Sissoko at LAM. He was ok against Everton. We need options from the bench, so Sonny should start from there with Llorente to give us more than one attacking option.

    We win, and the whole talk of a Wembley hoodoo will be thrown out the garbage and will give us the confidence to believe we can progress from this group.
  18. AJ201 Well-Known Member

    AJ201
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    Bemused why people would start with Sissoko. Dembele to come back in for him and Son for Alli. Not sure about RB it depends how far up to speed Aurier is, would keep the rest of the team the same as the weekend.
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  19. rhonkt Well-Known Member

    rhonkt
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    Lloris
    Toby-Sanchez-Jan
    Aurier-Dier-Dembele-Davies
    --Eriksen---Son
    Kane

    Win would be great, but draw would at least keep us alive. We can't simply assume that both us and Dortmund will get 0 points from Real and 6 from Apoel.

    Loss would be big trouble.
  20. BrooklynYid Well-Known Member

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    Time to show what we're made of. Speed will a crucial in this match so I think Aurier is a must-start. yeah, yeah, he hasn't settled with us, blah blah. Run fast. Tackle hard. Sorted. :) Would continue with a back 3. Not sure what Dembele's status is and it looks like Wanyama is still out. Lamela and Wanyama would be perfect for this match. We need to leave some stud marks out there. No matter. We won't concede and we will find a way to a goal. Let's show some friggin balls! COYS!

    ------------------------Lloris---------------------------
    ----Toby------------Sanchez---------Jan-----------
    Aurier------Dier------------Dembele?-----Davies
    Son-------------------Kane------------------Eriksen

    Was tempted to start Kane and Llorente up top just to throw them a curveball but this is a good looking side. Winks for Dembele and Sissoko on fro Eriksen or Son to see the match out. Can't wait!
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  21. kayat Well-Known Member

    kayat
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    Poch will try to play aggressive against Dortmund, 3-4-3 formation can be foresee as the one against Everton.
    Son replaced Dele at front three. If Sissoko is not injured, I will put Sissoko ahead of Dembele.
    Dortmund will press very very high and very very quick at our back, I can't see us can pass the ball on ground easily through midfield, even Dembele can't have enough time to control the ball easily and dribble upfront. It is risky in midfield to lose the ball...
    I prefer a lot of long and high through balls from the back. Sissoko runs help to provide options in front, which Dembele seldom do that.
    If Dortmund got speedy counterattack, SSK pacing on defensive side might help...

    It is also interesting if Kane and Llorente can be partner while Dele's suspension. Llorente got rich Europe games experience, I believe he can lead the front and his aerial ability is good enough to challenge Dortmund Defence.

    COYS.
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  22. ehh56 Well-Known Member

    ehh56
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    My feeling is that Sissoko will be out, or will at least not start. Too bad because it will be an end to end game. Could be that Dembele starts and comes off for Sissoko late if he tires. Llorente might well come in late. He'd be a good option if we are chasing a goal or protecting a lead, either one. I hope we don't have too many tired legs.
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  23. BrakeYawSelf Well-Known Member

    BrakeYawSelf
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    Well, if BvB do play the high press, then Sissoko might worry me more than Dembele. True Dembele might have a difficult time bringing the ball forward with his dribbling, but he would also be the best option to put a wall against their push forward. Also, Sissoko isn't exactly better than Dembele when it comes to the long pass. Sure his runs forward could help a lot, but that means Eriksen would have to drop back a bit to distribute the ball a lot. He would have to take over the CM responsibilities on attack. Which might work, but this switch will cost a few extra seconds that the team might not have.

    And I worry that Sissoko could be a liability defensively if BvB push high and hard. It could leave Dier by himself to have to deal with it. Now if Dembele played he could theoretically hold the ball and pass it back to Dier to distribute down field with the long pass. That's likely what they would have to do to pick teams apart. But if BvB have a fast counter, the switch Eriksen and Sissoko would have to make might take a second too long and allow BvB too much space up the middle. Also, I don't trust Sissoko nearly as much as Dembele to maintain possession or to get the ball back to Dier and the CBs cleanly. At least when Dembele is in there you can usually trust him to dribble the ball close enough to one of our other players to drop the ball off. Sissoko, having to charge up field, will have to leave the ball with someone and I could see him making more than a few mistakes in the process. It's a shame Wanyama isn't fit or I would definitely say to start Dier and Wanyama.

    I actually might even be inclined to start Winks, because he does have the passing attributes to be able to pick a team apart from the CM position. I just wonder if he would be too much a defensive liability also.

    There is also the other option, to just start Eriksen in front of Dier as the CM. And then just start Sissoko at the more AM role. Eriksen has performed well lately when started in the pivot, but I haven't seen this happen against such a high level of competition as BvB. This latter option might be what I would go with. Winks, as tempting as that might be, might not be ready for this. That 's something only MP would really know I gather.
  24. moe888 Well-Known Member

    moe888
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    Lets be fair to Sissoko, he did well against everton. Gave us a kind of option that is otherwise not available in our team. However his form is nowhere near what it should be to warrant a start against fooking Dortmund. I agree with your two changes from the last game. Not sure what stat Aurier is in, so would be odd to start him as well.
  25. bfwolf Well-Known Member

    bfwolf
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    I can't believe there's actually a Dembele vs Sissoko argument. Are you kidding me? Dembele is one of the best players on the team and Sissoko one of the worst if not the worst.

    I also firmly believe Aurier has to start this match. He'll be fresh, and we need his defensive capabilities and speed.
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  26. yidrules Member

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    .......................................................Lloris

    .................Toby............................Sanchez...........................Jan

    Trippier..........................Sissoko.....................Dembele....................Davies

    ..................Son..................................................................Eriksen

    ........................................................Kane

    COYS
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  27. MichiganStateSpur18 Active Member

    MichiganStateSpur18
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    No Dier?! You're insane! :eek:o_O
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  28. moe888 Well-Known Member

    moe888
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    Theres a reason Dembele was rested. No way im hell would Poch risk going in a big game against difficult opposition without him.

    When Dortmund will press for the ball, which player would I pass to who I know would not lose the ball when surrounded by a few players? Only two players in our team who I'd trust would be Dembele and Kane. Definitely not Sissoko or Winks and from what Wanyama did against Chelsea (and then his lack of reaction to losing the ball), I dont think Wanyama is ready for a big game.
  29. BrakeYawSelf Well-Known Member

    BrakeYawSelf
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    I would have to concur. I don't think there is any way Dembele sits out this game. Unless we are really behind towards the end of the game, I am not even sure he will get subbed.

    I am really not sure either way about Winks yet. I still feel like I have no idea what situations he is best suited for. But I wouldn't want to find out in a game like this.
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  30. Yorkshire Yid Well-Known Member

    Yorkshire Yid
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    Indeed even if we win it's not 100% we qualify but we need to to have any chance at all. Strange really that the most important game of the group is it's first one

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