Poch is he all that ?

Discussion in 'Players Lounge' started by ctw01, Feb 16, 2017.

  1. ctw01 Well-Known Member

    ctw01
    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2010
    Messages:
    10,508
    Location:
    N Wales
    Ratings:
    +3,399 / 42 / -0
  2. smallsnc Well-Known Member

    smallsnc
    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2012
    Messages:
    1,794
    Location:
    Winston-Salem, NC
    Ratings:
    +962 / 22 / -0
    I think Poch tells it like he sees and he is probably right in this case. The title of the article is misleading. He does not say he can't make us serial winners but that the biggest change that needs to take place is that the whole club has to change its mindset and that a) it is his hardest task and b) it takes time to change it and he may or may not be given that time.
  3. ctw01 Well-Known Member

    ctw01
    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2010
    Messages:
    10,508
    Location:
    N Wales
    Ratings:
    +3,399 / 42 / -0
    I have never been convinced by the guy, and though I am not close enough to know what goes on inside the club with regard to targets or the training ground with regard to management etc,, but I dont expect to see statements such as this from our highly rated coach, its criminal and paints an incredibly negative image of the club, FROM OUR OWN COACH !
  4. Dancubus Well-Known Member

    Dancubus
    Joined:
    May 27, 2009
    Messages:
    5,089
    Location:
    England
    Ratings:
    +1,956 / 11 / -0
    All he's basically said is that it takes time to build a winning mentality. Longer than 18 months, which I'd probably agree with to be honest. He said that it's his hardest job, which I'd agree with. Said that he might not get the time, well, looking at our revolving door history with managers, he could probably be forgiven in questioning that also.
  5. Why Do We Bother? Well-Known Member

    Why Do We Bother?
    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2012
    Messages:
    4,386
    Location:
    Northern Ireland / USA
    Ratings:
    +2,726 / 111 / -0
    He's only saying what every other manager we have had in the past 20 years has said....the mentality of the club will never change if we just will it so, or cross our fingers and toes and wish it hard enough to come true....it will only ever change if Levy changes it.....Pochettino has been here just about long enough now and the penny has finally dropped!!
  6. Merlin Active Member

    Merlin
    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2013
    Messages:
    359
    Location:
    North London
    Ratings:
    +283 / 4 / -0
    Currently, I'd say both team and manager flatter to deceive, whilst longing to be proved wrong.
    • Agree Agree x 1
  7. ctw01 Well-Known Member

    ctw01
    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2010
    Messages:
    10,508
    Location:
    N Wales
    Ratings:
    +3,399 / 42 / -0
    Massively !
  8. Shacklebolt 'Ello

    Shacklebolt
    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2013
    Messages:
    2,536
    Location:
    Scandinavia
    Ratings:
    +1,601 / 30 / -0
    I'm interested. Which current top teams managers do convince you? Wenger? Klopp? Mourinho? Conte is convincing of course but then again he's managing the best squad in the league and he can have any player he points at.

    When discussing managers only one aspect is really of interest and that is: Are we a better team now than we were before Pochettino joined? In my mind the answer to that question is yes and that's pretty much indisputable. When a significant period of time has gone by one can start questioning wether were still progressing or not. Well, this is only Pochettinos third season and in my humble opinion I still see sign of improvements. Not in every match of course but in the big scheme of things we are getting better each season.

    This is a bit like discussing player transfers. If you criticise our players when they are in a rough patch then I'd like you to name some viable options that would improve us. Let's face it, we won't sign Isco and we won't lure Conte here either.
    • Winner Winner x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. BrooklynYid Well-Known Member

    BrooklynYid
    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2013
    Messages:
    3,521
    Location:
    No sleep till...
    Ratings:
    +1,955 / 26 / -0
    My question is why isn't he motivating the players? They seemed asleep today. Is it him or are our players not disinterested? Something is afoot.
  10. oldmonovian Active Member

    oldmonovian
    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2014
    Messages:
    735
    Ratings:
    +353 / 28 / -0
    The problem I have is that everyone in the whole wide world knew that Sissouko was a waste of space ( look at the Newcastle fans forums) but still Poch allowed us to waste £30 million on him.

    Plus he has recruited prolific scorers ( Soldado and Janssen ) and turned them in to flops along with several other players who were well thought of before he came.

    Let us all hope that this is a temporary blip and that we batter Fulham on Sunday
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. oldmonovian Active Member

    oldmonovian
    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2014
    Messages:
    735
    Ratings:
    +353 / 28 / -0
    Or you could ask are we a better team than last season?
  12. the goat Well-Known Member

    the goat
    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2013
    Messages:
    1,111
    Location:
    england
    Ratings:
    +365 / 20 / -0
    part of building a winning mentality is having winners in your team, players who when the going gets tough can claim it down and get the team playing, mostly that comes from experienced players sometimes youngsters have it, but these players have strong personalities But that is something that I don't think Poch wants, as he can't control them
    • Agree Agree x 2
  13. Dave Well-Known Member

    Dave
    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2011
    Messages:
    6,077
    Location:
    England
    Ratings:
    +4,055 / 75 / -0
    It seems to be a bit Jekyll and Hyde with Poch. Some things he has done better than most managers ;- Built a very good, young team. Taken us up a level and we look a classy club.

    He also has done some things that are far worse than other bosses. His cup performances are a complete joke. Our transfers have been very poor at times and him and his coaching staff on Saturday especially, were fooking embarrassing.

    I dunno whats going on really. It seems the sob stories appear everytime we struggle. We go on great runs and then that's mirrored by bad runs.

    That performance tonight was what I expected. Half arsed throughout.
    Dave,
  14. ctw01 Well-Known Member

    ctw01
    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2010
    Messages:
    10,508
    Location:
    N Wales
    Ratings:
    +3,399 / 42 / -0
    Can you hear Mourinho Klopp or Conte speaking out in such a way ?

    Never

    There is a way to conduct your business and negativity is not on the agenda. I dont believe you give that impression to anyone especially weak minded players and the public, you are wrong if you do that, and that has upset me.

    How do you think Paul Clement @ Swansea and Marco Silva @ Hull approach their jobs in hand, they are not in a position of waiting a couple of seasons for their mentality to kick in, it has to happen NOW.

    Poche has spoken about instilling his "mentality"into the squad for long enough , yet despite his third season here, there is no doubt that it does not work, we are as weak minded now as we ever have been, he appears to be offering more excuses to fall back on too, such as the club culture and the new ground but for me he"s had enough time to get things right mentally.

    I dont see what transfers has to do with this but if you insist, players have been mentioned on a number of occassions that would at least maintain the level we are at if changes have to be made in games such as Dembele now Celtic, Gray Leicester or Redmond Southampton, all would have made more contribution than what we ended up with and for less money.
  15. kawa Well-Known Member

    kawa
    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2012
    Messages:
    1,523
    Location:
    UK
    Ratings:
    +675 / 34 / -0
    If Mourinho, Klopp or Conte were managing Tottenham Hotspur, yeah I'd expect them to speak out like that. Mourinho routinely criticises the mentality of his players.

    Paul Clement and Marco Silva are fighting relegation battles, so they need those results immediately. Poch has made us a solid top-four team, and is trying to push us that little bit extra to win the title.

    When he says that a winning mentality is needed, he makes it clear that it's not just the players but also the club at large. Hard to know exactly what he means by that, but it was in the paper last week that Sadio Mane visited our training ground but we wouldn't pay the wages he wanted - maybe that's the kind of thing he's pointing to. Celtic's Dembele was very keen to come here, but we refused to loan him back for the rest of the season; typically managers identify the players they want and it's up to the chairman to get them, so maybe he's referring to those kinds of things.

    I still think Poch is doing a fantastic job and if you can't see the massive improvements since he arrived, I really don't know what to tell you.
    kawa,
    • Agree Agree x 1
  16. Billywhizz Well-Known Member

    Billywhizz
    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2008
    Messages:
    1,135
    Location:
    England
    Ratings:
    +790 / 8 / -0
    I don't see anything in that article that makes me angry at all.

    The guy's taken us too our highest ever finish in the pl and we're currently in the same position this season, despite and I know ppl don't like this argument but we are punching above our weight in terms of resources. The biggest issue I have with him, is the transfer policy, we're buying a few too many duds and not enough of the real quality that'll take us to another level.

    The buck doesn't always fall at the feet of the manager, it's important to remember how poor the players have performed of late. These are grown men, paid an absolute fortune doing what they love, they shouldn't need the manager to constantly fire them up for every game, he can only do so much, the players have a responsibility to the themselves, the club and most importantly the fans to show the passion and performance they're paid a princely sum for.

    Of course he has his faults, he's very young, it's natural to have your faults at that age but he's a very promising manager and I have no real issues with him but he does still have a fair amount to learn still. The other thing is, are we just gonna keep getting rid of managers every 2-3 years if they keep coming up short. Personally, I think it's too early to be jumping all over the guy!

    Also @oldmonovian, Avb bought Soldado.
  17. ctw01 Well-Known Member

    ctw01
    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2010
    Messages:
    10,508
    Location:
    N Wales
    Ratings:
    +3,399 / 42 / -0
    I hope as much as anyone else he can produce something to show for a whole season this time, thats fair enough in my opinion.
  18. harrys lovechild Well-Known Member

    harrys lovechild
    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2011
    Messages:
    3,914
    Location:
    england
    Ratings:
    +1,925 / 5 / -0
    Best manager we have had for years, and like the players he is allowed a rough patch, he has plenty of runs on the board for me to start rubbishing him.
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  19. ctw01 Well-Known Member

    ctw01
    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2010
    Messages:
    10,508
    Location:
    N Wales
    Ratings:
    +3,399 / 42 / -0
    I havent called for his head but I disagree with his comments, he should be banging the table with his fist and show character, instead of giving in to the widely held premise everyone has of this club, which has hung round the neck for decades, it churns my guts.
    I hate having to listen to tossers like Gerrard and Ferdinand reveling on tv in ripping this club to shreds for its lack of character or bottle etc.
    Too many accept this sh*t and the situation needs to change, and it doesnt help hearing our leader contribute to this bollox.
  20. VASpur Active Member

    VASpur
    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2012
    Messages:
    854
    Location:
    Hampton Roads, VA
    Ratings:
    +292 / 12 / -0
    Do you know what he does behind the scenes? B/c from what I heard, he will get in your face and let you know you are shit and its not acceptable
    • Agree Agree x 1
  21. Ginola'sWhiteHeart Well-Known Member

    Ginola'sWhiteHeart
    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2012
    Messages:
    1,798
    Location:
    My High Trojan Horse
    Ratings:
    +1,457 / 15 / -0
    I disagree wholeheartedly, particularly with the bolded part.

    I think this may be a knee jerk reaction to a poor display yesterday & rough patch that we are going through.

    Our mentality has changed considerably under Poch. Good examples are the Chelsea matches. Arsenal, & beating Man City a couple of times whereas even the year before Poch arrived, under AVB, we capitulated badly against those clubs & others when the going got tough.

    I do agree that something is amiss of late as these performances are not indicative of Poch's philosophy. Even if we were outscored, we rarely if ever were outworked. Teams are starting to do that to us & I don't know why.
  22. Shacklebolt 'Ello

    Shacklebolt
    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2013
    Messages:
    2,536
    Location:
    Scandinavia
    Ratings:
    +1,601 / 30 / -0
    Excactly. I don't know if some actually have a bad memory or if they just choose to forget to justify their own point of view.
    • Like Like x 1
  23. Shacklebolt 'Ello

    Shacklebolt
    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2013
    Messages:
    2,536
    Location:
    Scandinavia
    Ratings:
    +1,601 / 30 / -0
    That's a question that should be answered when the season is over and not in february.
  24. helen7 Well-Known Member

    helen7
    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2013
    Messages:
    1,085
    Location:
    uk
    Ratings:
    +590 / 78 / -0
    The problem is that we weaknesses that are easily exposed.

    1. Lloris is unable to control the ball at his feet and pass it out. Close down the defenders and watch him kick it to touch.
    2. We only play the ball to feet. This must be something insisted on by the coach. So many times we see Walker bomb down the flank and having to slow his run as the ball is played almost behind him.
    3. Alli seems the only player on the pitch that is willing to play the ball with 1 touch. Everyone else needs 3 or 4 touches before passing the ball.
    4. Without Danny Rose, we cannot penetrate defenses.

    We do play well at times, but it has been far too infrequent this season. We have given away far too many points to poor opposition this season.
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  25. ctw01 Well-Known Member

    ctw01
    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2010
    Messages:
    10,508
    Location:
    N Wales
    Ratings:
    +3,399 / 42 / -0
    Im talking about his media comments if you read things properly
  26. ctw01 Well-Known Member

    ctw01
    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2010
    Messages:
    10,508
    Location:
    N Wales
    Ratings:
    +3,399 / 42 / -0
    Last night is a bad memory too and I dont choose to remember.
  27. ctw01 Well-Known Member

    ctw01
    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2010
    Messages:
    10,508
    Location:
    N Wales
    Ratings:
    +3,399 / 42 / -0
    We fell apart after Chelsea last season, something the players need to put behind them even now as the Liverpool result could be having the same affect , but my god I hope not.
  28. hrytn Well-Known Member

    hrytn
    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2013
    Messages:
    4,079
    Location:
    London
    Ratings:
    +1,454 / 77 / -0
    Who told you?
    • Like Like x 1
  29. rhonkt Well-Known Member

    rhonkt
    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2012
    Messages:
    4,080
    Location:
    U.S.
    Ratings:
    +1,739 / 29 / -0
    What a fooking load of shite in this thread.

    Is he all that? Yes he is. I don't even need to explain.

    So we've lost a couple games, get a fooking grip.

    If we finish 6th then we can open this thread back up.
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 2
  30. aewallace81 Well-Known Member

    aewallace81
    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2008
    Messages:
    1,401
    Location:
    England
    Ratings:
    +160 / 3 / -0
    The good days are really good and its easy to undersand the system. Then we have the bad days where it appears there is no game plan, is it the players? I don't think so, Poch needs to be stronger when things are not going right and make examples of players who are not carrying out instructions and not working hard enough. The other option is to find another way of playing because at the moment its only pressing which makes us perform.
    • Like Like x 1

Share This Page